Comments on: THE PRICE OF CARELESSNESS http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/ Massad Ayoob on Firearms, Self-defense, and the 2nd Amendment Sat, 21 Nov 2009 02:41:42 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: L. T. Wakeling http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1975 L. T. Wakeling Fri, 13 Nov 2009 16:22:47 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1975 When I teach NRA firearm courses I stress to the students "what is the first thing you do when you pickup a firearm?" You get all kinds of answers and then I tell them "You point the muzzle in a safe direction first because if the gun goes off no one will get shot" It takes three thing to happen for a firearm to discharge. You need a gun, you need ammunition and you need a finger. If any one of the three are missing the gun won't go off. Treat every firearm as a loaded firearm and only point it in a safe direction. Yes I have had an ND one time only thank God. I was working on a feeding problem with a pump 32-20 rifle with a live round not a dummy round, hand off the trigger but in front of trigger guard and working the action. Gave it a hard tug and guess what? My hand sliped brushed the trigger and I shot the ceeling. I only use Dummy rounds from that day forward 50 years ago. When I teach NRA firearm courses I stress to the students “what is the first thing you do when you pickup a firearm?” You get all kinds of answers and then I tell them “You point the muzzle in a safe direction first because if the gun goes off no one will get shot”
It takes three thing to happen for a firearm to discharge. You need a gun, you need ammunition and you need a finger. If any one of the three are missing the gun won’t go off. Treat every firearm as a loaded firearm and only point it in a safe direction.
Yes I have had an ND one time only thank God. I was working on a feeding problem with a pump 32-20 rifle with a live round not a dummy round, hand off the trigger but in front of trigger guard and working the action. Gave it a hard tug and guess what? My hand sliped brushed the trigger and I shot the ceeling. I only use Dummy rounds from that day forward 50 years ago.

]]> By: castor http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1702 castor Tue, 15 Sep 2009 03:31:48 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1702 I had a 'could-have-been' that really scared me. I used to put the bolt in the receiver, leaving it open for safety, and slip the mag onto the rifle when I was having my last cup of coffee before I went hunting. I did so to ensure I didn't get all the way out to the bush before discovering I had left one of them at home. One morning I got the 'remove the mag, close the bolt' sequence out order without realizing it when I took the rifle out of the house. All the way to the bush the rifle sat in the truck with a live round up the spout. 'Thank God I didn't click the trigger' was the first thing I thought when I opened the bolt in the bush and saw the loaded round. "There but for the grace of God ...." I had a ‘could-have-been’ that really scared me. I used to put the bolt in the receiver, leaving it open for safety, and slip the mag onto the rifle when I was having my last cup of coffee before I went hunting. I did so to ensure I didn’t get all the way out to the bush before discovering I had left one of them at home. One morning I got the ‘remove the mag, close the bolt’ sequence out order without realizing it when I took the rifle out of the house. All the way to the bush the rifle sat in the truck with a live round up the spout. ‘Thank God I didn’t click the trigger’ was the first thing I thought when I opened the bolt in the bush and saw the loaded round. “There but for the grace of God ….”

]]> By: PrimalSeal http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1325 PrimalSeal Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:53:49 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1325 Being a NRA Trained Firearms instructor, the main focus of all my classes is, of course, safety. As stated above, sometimes keeping your finger OFF the trigger until ready to fire isn't always the only requirement. We could probably sit here and "Monday Morning Quarterback" everything the hapless individual in this case did wrong, but the truth is this person will hopefully learn from their obvious mistake and not repeat it. I tell my students that constant vigilance is key to safe gun handling skills. Nothing short of this will suffice. Without concentrated attention to the extreme detail, it's not a matter of if you have an accidental discharge, it's when. With this, I am also a member of the US Military, and God knows what the ramifications a situation like this would have upon a career. With every firearms qualification, we are run through the proper clearing procedures, and practice them daily while deployed. This repetition can be good or bad depending on your level of awareness, as it's easy to lapse into a state of false security. Many times at the range I've asked myself, "Did I make sure the chamber was clear?". There is nothing wrong with double checking either, so don't be afraid to look stupid. You never know, it just might save someones life, or in this case, their toe. Being a NRA Trained Firearms instructor, the main focus of all my classes is, of course, safety. As stated above, sometimes keeping your finger OFF the trigger until ready to fire isn’t always the only requirement. We could probably sit here and “Monday Morning Quarterback” everything the hapless individual in this case did wrong, but the truth is this person will hopefully learn from their obvious mistake and not repeat it. I tell my students that constant vigilance is key to safe gun handling skills. Nothing short of this will suffice. Without concentrated attention to the extreme detail, it’s not a matter of if you have an accidental discharge, it’s when.

With this, I am also a member of the US Military, and God knows what the ramifications a situation like this would have upon a career. With every firearms qualification, we are run through the proper clearing procedures, and practice them daily while deployed. This repetition can be good or bad depending on your level of awareness, as it’s easy to lapse into a state of false security. Many times at the range I’ve asked myself, “Did I make sure the chamber was clear?”. There is nothing wrong with double checking either, so don’t be afraid to look stupid. You never know, it just might save someones life, or in this case, their toe.

]]> By: Autosurgeon http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1323 Autosurgeon Tue, 16 Jun 2009 23:38:45 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1323 My one and I hope only ND happened one night when I was replacing the sear spring on a striker fired pistol. I didn't know it but the parts house had sent me a spring that looked the same but was 6 lbs lighter. After I installed it I tried the gun with snap caps and everything seemed OK. Then I pointed it at the floor and chambered a live round. BOOM the gun fired and the bullet hit a steel plate that was on the floor and glanced up and through a window of the house. It went out the window and glanced off the stop sign on the corner my house sits on and then hit the road... I even found the spent bullet a little the worse for wear after its trip. Let me tell you I learned something ... never assume pointing at the floor is enough. I now have a 5 gallon bucket of sand that I point into when chambering my carry guns in the house. I also DO NOT chamber firearms I have been working on other than to clean them in the house ... only at the range while aimed at a berm down range. My one and I hope only ND happened one night when I was replacing the sear spring on a striker fired pistol. I didn’t know it but the parts house had sent me a spring that looked the same but was 6 lbs lighter. After I installed it I tried the gun with snap caps and everything seemed OK. Then I pointed it at the floor and chambered a live round. BOOM the gun fired and the bullet hit a steel plate that was on the floor and glanced up and through a window of the house. It went out the window and glanced off the stop sign on the corner my house sits on and then hit the road… I even found the spent bullet a little the worse for wear after its trip. Let me tell you I learned something … never assume pointing at the floor is enough. I now have a 5 gallon bucket of sand that I point into when chambering my carry guns in the house. I also DO NOT chamber firearms I have been working on other than to clean them in the house … only at the range while aimed at a berm down range.

]]> By: Wish Belkin http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1275 Wish Belkin Thu, 04 Jun 2009 09:30:11 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1275 Shot my dashboard once. Filled the hole with an 8-track player. (it was a long time ago) My ears still ring. If you're going to have a ND inside a car, open the windows. Shot my dashboard once.
Filled the hole with an 8-track player.
(it was a long time ago)
My ears still ring.
If you’re going to have a ND inside a car,
open the windows.

]]> By: youngndumb http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1272 youngndumb Wed, 03 Jun 2009 16:51:58 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1272 I learned the hard way with a BB gun when I was 10years old. Went straight through the middle of my big toe nail and out the bottom of my shoe. Im a lucky and fast learner. I learned the hard way with a BB gun when I was 10years old. Went straight through the middle of my big toe nail and out the bottom of my shoe. Im a lucky and fast learner.

]]> By: Paul http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1263 Paul Tue, 02 Jun 2009 02:12:54 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1263 In my CHL class I have a Power Point presentation, part of gun safety. This presentation shows injuries incurred by NDs. One has the back of his ankle blown away by a 'friends' 12 gauge, another (after his operation) stitches where a .40 Glock went through the palm of his hand when he pulled the trigger of his Glock .40 (he 'thought' it was unloaded and had the other hand in front of the muzzle.) I also have other photos of various injuries. Another has a knee that was take out by a shotgun. Another a thumb blown off. Another a ND in the leg. Another.... well you get the point. If Mas would be so kind, I would like to use these photos above as part of the class. Believe me, students take notice when they see the photos! Thanks! In my CHL class I have a Power Point presentation, part of gun safety. This presentation shows injuries incurred by NDs. One has the back of his ankle blown away by a ‘friends’ 12 gauge, another (after his operation) stitches where a .40 Glock went through the palm of his hand when he pulled the trigger of his Glock .40 (he ‘thought’ it was unloaded and had the other hand in front of the muzzle.) I also have other photos of various injuries. Another has a knee that was take out by a shotgun. Another a thumb blown off. Another a ND in the leg. Another…. well you get the point.

If Mas would be so kind, I would like to use these photos above as part of the class. Believe me, students take notice when they see the photos!

Thanks!

]]> By: AntonK http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1251 AntonK Sat, 30 May 2009 15:40:50 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1251 Excellent post and great comments to on the need for constant vigilance when using or otherwise handling your firearm. PS. Mass, your RSS feed has been down for a couple of weeks now. Excellent post and great comments to on the need for constant vigilance when using or otherwise handling your firearm.

PS. Mass, your RSS feed has been down for a couple of weeks now.

]]> By: Chris Smith http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1250 Chris Smith Fri, 29 May 2009 12:11:38 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1250 1. I am in possession of an Ithaca 1911A1 which was my dad's sidearm at the end of WW2. He came to be in possession of said sidearm when, in command of a Marine Corps rifle company on Guam training for the invasion of Japan, one of the men in his company was messing around with this pistol in the barracks tent. The marine in question had a negligent discharge with direct muzzle contact, directly into the heel of the palm of his hand, carrying away about half of his hand and two fingers. My dad confiscated the weapon and kept it for his own, since his personally purchased civilian 1911 had been taken from him after he was WIA at Iwo Jima, and he figured that Ma Green owed him one government model .45. 2. I worked in an ER for 6 years at one time in my life, and I once helped to treat a gunshot victim who had negligently shot himself in exactly the same way as in #1, but with a .357 magnum revolver. Same results: missing at least half his hand, including two fingers. 3. I personally had a negligent discharge 15 years ago of a .44 magnum, pointed at the ceiling, about 12 inches from my left ear. To this day, hearing in my left ear is only about 80% of what it is in my right ear - which isn't as good as it used to be either. I've been a religious zealot about gun safety ever since. Please note that I purposefully did not use the words "accidental discharge" in any case. Unintentional discharges of firearms are almost always negligence on the part of the shooter. 1. I am in possession of an Ithaca 1911A1 which was my dad’s sidearm at the end of WW2. He came to be in possession of said sidearm when, in command of a Marine Corps rifle company on Guam training for the invasion of Japan, one of the men in his company was messing around with this pistol in the barracks tent. The marine in question had a negligent discharge with direct muzzle contact, directly into the heel of the palm of his hand, carrying away about half of his hand and two fingers. My dad confiscated the weapon and kept it for his own, since his personally purchased civilian 1911 had been taken from him after he was WIA at Iwo Jima, and he figured that Ma Green owed him one government model .45.

2. I worked in an ER for 6 years at one time in my life, and I once helped to treat a gunshot victim who had negligently shot himself in exactly the same way as in #1, but with a .357 magnum revolver. Same results: missing at least half his hand, including two fingers.

3. I personally had a negligent discharge 15 years ago of a .44 magnum, pointed at the ceiling, about 12 inches from my left ear. To this day, hearing in my left ear is only about 80% of what it is in my right ear – which isn’t as good as it used to be either. I’ve been a religious zealot about gun safety ever since.

Please note that I purposefully did not use the words “accidental discharge” in any case. Unintentional discharges of firearms are almost always negligence on the part of the shooter.

]]> By: Mike Snodgrass http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/comment-page-1/#comment-1247 Mike Snodgrass Thu, 28 May 2009 19:09:31 +0000 http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2009/05/25/the-price-of-carelessness/#comment-1247 A local gunshop had a bullet hole in the top of a glass display case, and another on each of the two lower display levels directly underneath. Why? Because some moron brought a pistol in to trade and when the owner told him to open the action for a safety check, the guy said not to worry because he had verified it was unloaded before he put it in the case before leaving home. Then he pointed it at the display case and pulled the trigger. No one was hurt and the bullet miraculously missed the guns in the case as well. Property damage is the BEST that can happen from an accidental discharge and the ramifications increase exponentially from there. I never shy away from defending the Second Amendment, but there are a lot of idiots with guns and they do nothing to help our cause. A local gunshop had a bullet hole in the top of a glass display case, and another on each of the two lower display levels directly underneath. Why? Because some moron brought a pistol in to trade and when the owner told him to open the action for a safety check, the guy said not to worry because he had verified it was unloaded before he put it in the case before leaving home. Then he pointed it at the display case and pulled the trigger. No one was hurt and the bullet miraculously missed the guns in the case as well. Property damage is the BEST that can happen from an accidental discharge and the ramifications increase exponentially from there. I never shy away from defending the Second Amendment, but there are a lot of idiots with guns and they do nothing to help our cause.

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